Compiled by Rachel Cory-Kuehl, November 2012

Last edited: August 31, 2022

Scripture is from the NKJV unless otherwise noted.

BEFORE THE WORLD WAS

The Son of God existed before His incarnation. He created this earth and “the heavens.” “Before the world was,” He shared glory with God His Father. He told the disciples He was going to “ascend up where He was before.” He went to sit at the right hand of His Father. One would assume this is the place He occupied before He was “sent” to the earth.

John 6:62 “Then what if you see the Son of Man ascend to where he was before! (NIV)

John 13:1 “. . . Jesus knew that his hour had come to depart from this world and go to the Father.”

2 Corinthians 8:9 “For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich.”

John 17:5 “And now, O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was.”

John 6:38 “For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.”

John 1:1-3, 10 “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.” 10 “He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him.”

He was “with God.” He was “God.” He was a divine being before the world was. The Greek word translated as ‘God,’ means ‘divine being.’ But was He a son before He was incarnated? Had He always existed, or did He have a beginning? The term ‘son’ implies the ‘Father’ existed first.

            I’m NOT saying the Son was created. He was begotten. I believe this was “the beginning.” Jesus called himself, “the beginning and the end” (Rev. 1:8, 11) and “the Beginning of the creation of God,” (Revelation 3:14) not because He was created, but because God the Father would create through Him.

In the study titled “Two Divine Beings” many Scriptures are collected which speak of TWO beings - “God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ”, or “the One who sits on the throne and the Lamb.” The words “not My will but Yours be done” (Lk 22:42), demonstrate the existence of two individual beings - each with a mind and will of His own.

Our question concerns the relationship of the One to the Other - prior to the incarnation. Was one a Father, and the other a Son? Can we demonstrate that one was above the other - in authority, prior to the incarnation? Such a hierarchy would suggest a Father/Son relationship.

1.   Jesus said He was “sent” by His Father. Seventeen verses confirm this. He was “sent” from the heavenly spirit realm to the earthly physical realm. He was sent to do the will of His Father. This suggests hierarchy - with the Father occupying the higher position.

John 6:38 “For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.

2.   We read that God created all things through His Son. The divine Father is described as the originator of the creation, and His Son was the agent to carry out the will and plan of His Father. This suggests hierarchy.

Colossians 1:15-17 “He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. . . . All things     were created through Him and for Him.”

We see the created heavenly beings giving credit for the existence of all things, to “Him who sits on the throne.” The entire family in heaven and earth is named from the Father (Eph. 3:14-15).

Revelation 4:9-11 “Whenever the living creatures give glory and honor and thanks to Him who sits on the throne, who lives forever and ever, 10 the twenty-four elders fall down before Him who sits on the throne and worship Him who lives forever and ever, . . . saying: 11 ‘You are worthy, O Lord, To receive glory and honor and power; For You created all things, And by Your will they exist and were created.’”

            This verse upholds “the Father” as the originator of all life, and all that is.

Hebrews 1:1-3 “God, who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds; who being the brightness of His glory and the express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high.”

God “made the worlds” through His Son. God has “appointed” his Son heir of all things. He existed in the form of God. He was “the express image” of His Father. An “image” is a copy - of an original. He did not seek to grasp equality - of rule - with God His Father. All these things suggest hierarchy.

Philippians 2:5 “You should have the same attitude toward one another that Christ Jesus had, who though he existed in the form of God did not regard equality with God as something to be grasped.”

I believe the speaker in the next passage, is the pre-incarnate Son of God. He is begotten and anointed before the earth exists. He will be called “the anointed one” (Heb. 1:9). He is the Master Craftsman to carry out the design of the One who beget Him.

            Note: Proverbs Cpt 8 is an allegory on wisdom. Paul called Christ - “wisdom from God” (1Cor 1:23-24, 30 ).

Proverbs 8:22-30 The LORD possessed me at (or as) the beginning of His way, before His works of old. I have been established (anointed) from everlasting, from the beginning, before there was ever an earth.

When there were no depths I was brought forth (He begets me), When there were no fountains abounding with water. 25 Before the mountains were settled, Before the hills, I was brought forth; 26 While as yet He had not made the earth or the fields, Or the primeval dust of the world.

27 When He prepared the heavens, I was there, When He drew a circle on the face of the deep, 28 When He established the clouds above, When He strengthened the fountains of the deep, 29 When He assigned to the sea its limit, So that the waters would not transgress His command, When He marked out the foundations of the earth, 30 Then I was beside Him as a master craftsman; And I was daily His delight, Rejoicing always before Him . . .”

NOTE: The NET translation, and several others, render Prov. 8:22 as “the LORD created me as the beginning of his works.” Christ says He was begotten. Proverbs 8 says “I was brought forth.” “Brought forth” is translated from the Hebrew word meaning “to be given birth.” He was not created from nothing. God beget a second divine being, from out of Himself. Jesus said, “I came forth from God” (Jn 16:27).

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A TRINITY?

     OR FATHER AND SON?

What was the Son’s relationship with “the Father,” prior to His incarnation. Was He the “Son of God” before He became “the Son of Man?” I say yes.

NOTE: He was not of course, the man Jesus, prior to His incarnation. He was “the Angel of the LORD” and “the Word of God.” (The word translated “angel” means “messenger.”) His name was Michael. The name means “like unto God,” and the Son was the express image - exact copy - of God His Father. No created being could be called “Michael” - like unto God. That name fits only one being in the universe - the “Son of God.” (For a study on the Son of God through the Old Testament period, see our study: “The Mediator.”

Was “the Son” one of three co-equal, co-eternal divine beings, who together make up “God” (or the “Godhead”)? If that was the case, then He was not literally “the Son” of God the Father. Rather, He was one of three divine beings, any one of which could have assumed the role of “a Son.”

Who was Jesus? Peter said, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” And Jesus replied, “Upon this rock I will build My church.” The “rock” - upon which the church is built - is the identity of Jesus Christ.

While on this earth, Christ spoke constantly of His Father in Heaven. Was He referring to the Holy Spirit who impregnated His mother Mary (Matt. 1:18, 20), or to the other divine being in the heavenly realm, the One who sits on a throne? Assuming you believe that God is a Trinity, which one of the two was Jesus “father?” Did Jesus have one father? Or two? Did Jesus have a “father” in our sense of the word? If He was without beginning, then He really had no father. He assumed the role of a son, or became a son when He was born from Mary. Another person of the Trinity assumed the role of father. This is NOT - of course, what I believe. I am just pointing out a flaw in the argument for a Trinity. Trinitarians will say such things are beyond our understanding, so we must just accept. I believe the Apostles of Christ wrote the New Testament so that we can understand.

ONE FATHER

Matthew 23:9 “Do not call anyone on earth your father; for One is your Father, He who is in heaven.”

Jesus called His “father” - “My God” (Rev. 3:12, Jn 20:17). He said there is only ONE Father. He said that He “came forth from” that Father, and then was “sent by” that Father into the world. He called His Father - “the only true God.”

John 17:1-3 “Father . . . that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.”

1 Corinthians 8:6 “Yet for us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and through whom we live.”

Ephesians 4:6 “ . . . one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in all.”

NOTE: If the one Father is “through all” then He is omnipresent. He is not just sitting on a throne at one spot in Heaven. He is spirit. He is “the invisible God” except where and when He chooses to make Himself visible.

John 16:28 “I came forth from the Father AND have come into the world.”

1 John 4:14 “And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent the Son as Savior of the world.”

1 John 2:22-23 “He is Antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.”

Antichrist denies that God ever beget a Son.

Both Judaism and Islam, deny that God ever beget a Son.

Catholicism and most Protestant denominations deny that Christ

              was literally the Son of God the Father prior to His incarnation.

GOD ABOVE ALL

Did God - the “one Father,” manifest Himself in three ways - as Father, as Son, and as Holy Spirit? In which case Jesus the Christ was not actually “the Son of God.” He was one of three manifestations of “God our Father.”

            Question: In what sense then, did God give His only begotten Son?

John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have ever-lasting life.”

This study is titled “Show Us the Father.” I am trying to show you there really is - literally - a divine Father who gave His divine Son, that we might live forever.

            Jesus said, “My Father is greater than I.” This suggests two beings.

      The Son is/and will forever be “subject to” His Father (1Cor. 15:24-28). This suggests two beings.

            “The head of Christ is God” (1Cor. 11:3). This shows hierarchy, with one above the other.

      “Not my will, but Yours be done” (Lk 22:42). This shows two individuals, each with mind and will.

Ephesians 4:4-6 “There is . . . one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.”

If God the Father is “above all” then He is above His Son. Jesus confirmed this. Paul confirmed this. This is hierarchy, with the Father having greater authority than His Son.

WHAT I BELIEVE

      1.   The Father is a single, unique, always existent, divine being.

      2.   The Father beget another divine being out of Himself.

                  The Father called this second divine being - “My Son.”

      3.   The Father created all things - through His Son.

      4.   The Father communicates with His creation - through His Son.

      5.   Jesus is “the only begotten of God the Father” (Jn 1:14).

            Therefore God the Father literally gave His only begotten Son,

                  first - to be a “son of man,” and second - to die.

      6.   The Father sent His Son to reconcile human kind to Himself. They were estranged from Him.

He sent His begotten Son into the world (via the womb of Mary), to save those who could be reconciled.

7. At the time of His incarnation, the Son of God “emptied Himself” of all divine power. He must overcome Satan and sin, as a man, to win back dominion of the earth for mankind.

      8.   The Father gave His divine/human Son authority to speak for Him, to judge, and to execute judgment. He also gave His Son indwelling life, to heal and to restore.

      9.   The Father sent His Son as the living example of His Law - to show men how to live.

      10. God the Father resurrected His Son from death.

      11. After His Son returned to sit at His right hand, the Father poured His spirit through His Son, empowering His Son to communicate with us as the Comforter Spirit (Gal. 4:6).

WHY did God beget - a Son?

            In an attempt to save a first child with leukemia, parents sometimes will have another child so they can use the placental cord blood of the second child, to save their first child. Did God the Father do something like this? Was God’s Son begotten only after God’s first children became estranged? Answer: No!

The Son of God “created all things” - including all the angels. He certainly existed before Lucifer’s rebellion, and before Adam sinned.

            The beings created were not “lost” when He created them. Everything was “very good.”

The incarnation of the Son of God was not a reaction - on the part of God, to something unanticipated. God knew, before He created angels and human beings, that the rebellion would come. (That is not to say it was inevitable. He simply knew it was going to happen.) He planned for the rescue and reconciliation. The Son of God was begotten for that rescue. The Father alone, could not incarnate and then die, while he continued to uphold all things by His power.

SOMEONE LIKE US

Effective ambassadors know how to speak the language of those they wish to communicate with. God the Father understands every language, and every thought. But we human beings could not really believe that, without seeing it. Jesus spoke our language - humanly speaking. He looked like us. He felt pain like us. He could understand. God the Father does too, but we don’t relate so easily - to Him. So the Father sent a love letter, through His Son.

Think of it. Christ’s death by torture, was a love letter from God our Father, telling us just how much He loves us.

JUSTICE WITH MERCY - VISIBLE AND UNDERSTANDABLE

Mankind was estranged from God the Father. Men lived in fear and misunderstanding. They thought that God was just a perfectionist, judgmental, punishing destroyer - always watching, and out to get them. What did Jesus say? “God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved” (John 3:17). Far from “out to get us,” the Father was “out to” save us. But He needed a way to pull us back to Himself. He needed a perfect judge, who would filter (obviously and visibly) the judgment through layers of mercy.

There’s an old saying. “Don’t judge a man, til you’ve walked a mile in his shoes. Jesus has walked many miles - in our shoes. He has experienced every temptation and every type of trial that we are exposed to. His judgment can be accepted as just and fair. The judgment of a distant “God” might not be. So what has the Father done? He has given all judgment to His Son. The Father judges no one! (Jn 5:22). Does THIS change your understanding of the Father? I hope so.

Question: Why does the Bible say that Jesus must intercede for us - with the Father? That sounds like the Father would destroy us, if Jesus didn’t plead with Him - to change His mind.

1 John 2:1 “My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous.”

Romans 8:34 “Who is he who condemns? It is Christ who died, and furthermore is also risen, who is     even at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us.”

Hebrews 7:25 “Therefore He is also able to save to the uttermost those who come to God through Him, since He always lives to make intercession for them.”

We must ask. With whom is Jesus “pleading.” If God never changes, how could Jesus “change” His Father’s will - about anything? What would be the point of pleading with Him?

Answer: I believe Jesus is pleading with us, on His Father’s behalf. Lots of pleading - with us, trying to help us make good choices for our lives.

Let’s look at this another way. Who is the prosecuting attorney, in this heavenly courtroom? Answer: Satan! He is called “the accuser of the brethren” (Rev. 12:10). The name “Satan” means “accuser.” He is also “the destroyer.” He is called Abbadon and Apollyon (Rev.9:11). Both of those names mean “Destroyer.” Those who refuse Christ will be left unprotected, to be destroyed by Satan. Christ will not be able to protect those who refuse to acknowledge Him.

WHY was the Son begotten?

            Answer: Because God wanted to create a family of sentient beings with free will.

            Answer: Because God the Father needed the perfect ambassador.

            Answer: Because God the Father wanted to send a love letter.

            Answer: Because God the Father wanted to win our love.

            Answer: Because God needed a judge who would be perceived as just.

            Answer: Because God needed a perfect man to be our example.

Satan had taken over dominion of earth (originally given to mankind) because Adam (the father of all mankind) had rebelled against his Creator. The Law said that God would protect only those who obey Him. Dominion could be recovered (legally) - only by a perfectly obedient man. So the Son of God became that man. He lived a perfectly obedient life, even through death by torture. He will ultimately recover dominion of this earth. Then He will share that dominion with those who serve Him. We don’t see this yet, but it’s not far off. I go into this in more detail, in the study “Dominion” here at Prophecy Viewpoint.

WHAT THE FATHER COULD NOT DO

No human being could “see” God, and live. Jesus said, “No one has seen the Father” (Jn 6:46). Jesus became a man, so that men could “see” the Father, and “hear” the Father. It was all about winning hearts and minds back to the Father. Jesus was “sent” to effect a reconciliation.

John 14:8-9 “Philip said to Him, ‘Lord, show us the Father, and it is sufficient for us.’ 9 Jesus said to him, ‘Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?’”

DEAD while LIVING?                                              

There was another thing that God the Father couldn’t do. He could not DIE - literally, fully and absolutely die - while at the same time energizing everything and every one. Even God could not CEASE to LIVE, and be ALIVE - both - at the same time, unless there were two - of HIM.

            Any loving parent would rather suffer the pain than watch a son or daughter suffer. How many times have we heard, “I wish it had happened to me.” God the Father suffered with His Son. He DIED through His Son. And while His Son lay DEAD in the tomb, the Father kept the created universe “alive.” God beget a Son - so He could die. I believe this was the plan from the beginning. This is WHY God needed an exact copy of Himself, to do what He could not do by Himself alone - to save the world.

WHEN - was the Son BEGOTTEN?

This is a very important question. It speaks volumes about our Father in Heaven. The answer to this question, tells me that God the Father anticipated the rebellion, or at least the possibility of rebellion. He “knew” that He would need to die one day - to win back the love of His created children? How could He do that, unless there were TWO of Him?

God through His Son, created beings with free will, knowing they would choose to go their own ways. (And we all know how that has turned out.) He beget a Son before anything was created, in order to one day save that creation. Now that is profound!

Jesus called Himself “the beginning.” I believe He was “the beginning.” Everything “began” with the Son.

Revelation 21:6 “And He said to me, ‘It is done! I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. I will give of the fountain of the water of life freely to him who thirsts.’”

Revelation 22:13 “I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.”

1John 2:13 “I write to you, father, because you have known Him who is from the beginning.”

Proverbs 8:22-23 “The LORD possessed me as the beginning of His way, before His works of old. I have been established from everlasting, from the beginning, before there was ever an earth.”

Note: In Revelation 3:14, Christ is called “the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God.” This does NOT mean that the Son of God was created. No. He was “begotten.” He was “the beginning of the creation” because God planned to create everything that was created - through His Son. (A wife, in a similar manner, is “the beginning” of a man’s family.)

Hebrews 1:1 God, who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, 2 has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds;

3 who being the brightness of His glory and the express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, . . .

5 For to which of the angels did He ever say: “You are My Son, Today I have begotten You “? And again: “I will be to Him a Father, And He shall be to Me a Son “? 6 But when He again brings the firstborn into the world, He says: “Let all the angels of God worship Him.” . . .

8 But to the Son He says: “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your Kingdom. 9 You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness; Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”

         10 And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth, And the heavens are the work of Your hands . . .”

For me, this passage most powerfully establishes the Son of God as also”God.” He was begotten (came forth) from God His Father, therefore He was begotten with the divine nature of His Father - God.

The term “god” tells us what He is, not who He is. “God” is not His name. It is a descriptive - like “human” is a descriptive term, or “woman” or “mammal.” The Greek word, translated into English as ‘god,’ means ‘divine being’ - as opposed to human being. “God” describes one who operates outside of known physical dimensions. And more than this, one who creates life - one from Whom life springs. Angels, as spirit beings, live outside of known physical dimensions, but they are created beings and cannot themselves create life. The Son of God created the earth and all living things within the entire universe of God. That alone, says He is divine.

The words highlighted in red, tell us that the Father “brought” His Son into our world. The Son of God did not accomplish His own incarnation.

CONCLUSION

I have tried to explain my understanding of the nature of God - as the Great Creator Father who beget a Son in His image. He wanted to create beings with high intelligence, with self awareness and most importantly with free will and the capacity to love. He wanted to communicate with His created children - on a level they could understand. He knew that one day He would need to die, in order to win them back to Himself, and He could do these things only if there were TWO - of Him. And so He beget a Son exactly like Himself. Then He gave that Son - for them.

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    “Now all things are of God,

             who has reconciled us to Himself

                     through Jesus Christ.”  

                                       2 Corinthians 5:18

We pray this study will prove a blessing.

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